Life after death after life?

[Royal Freakiness]

wooowwwwwwww I just came back from a three day trip, and some of the shit said in here is absolutely retarded  :lol:

Starting off, everyone who assumes tenets to evolution wrongly (aka jono and tito) clearly knows nothing about the actual facts and have a completely one-sided point of view, thereby rendering anything they say as verbal diarrhea. I mean, I didn't know that people like you even existed  :lol:

@Jono, if you're in 1st year medsci and you still don't understand evolution, then I can understand why our healthcare system is so bad, I mean, god DAYUMMM

I'm fairly sure all the evolution stuff has been covered by ed, so imma move on to the q'uran issues:

a: tito, the q'uran has a whole fuckload of holes in it, just like the bible. In fact, the q'uran is a mishmash of biblical tradition, mysticism, and imperialism, while the bible draws references from such classical works as the Sumerian Epic of Gilgamesh, etc...By nature, every religious text is full of holes, because it's viewpoint is utterly onesided and therefore imperfect. In addition, you say that a god transcends all human understanding, and yet we try to encompass It in a religious text, thereby committing gross anthropmorphism and likening the image of an infinite, eternal godhead figure to the human figure, or to concrete objects that humans can encompass intellectually. Arrogant, much?

Tito, I don't know what you think philosophy is, but it's rational, logical discourse to reach a conclusion. Religion is said to 'transcend' logic. Thus, how can religion be philosophical in any way?

Royalfreak, basically, you're making your own beliefs look stupid, so stop posting. Have you ever been exposed to any culture besides Islamic ones for any length of time in your life? Because you are saying 'my way is THE way' while maikng 'your way' sound like sheer idiocy. You should become a preacher just so people see the stupidity of blind faith.

thats a start...

Oh now your playing a dangerous game. Go on clever boy show me a single hole. I challenge you.

for more than 1400 years that's what non-Muslims have been trying to do
what makes this retard think he can prove the Qur'an false when he doesn't even have a copy of it...
he doesn't even know what lies in it... he doesn't even know how it started, coz he still thinks Prophet Muhammad had a bible next to him and thought of ways to make a nice bed time story with good etiquettes and ways to live a life...
come on professor, any proof? hmm?? if you care so much to make us lead a "free" way of life, go get yourself a copy of the translation of the Qur'an, put it next to great science books and religious text, then see how "false" the Qur'an is, or look for "holes"
I dare you and the WHOLE WORLD INCLUDING THE UNSEEN. that's Allah's and the Muslims' challenge to all of you ppl who still doubt the Truth of the Qur'an

[TheGodEmperor]

dude did you even read my post? Thats not at all what I said...but I'll address your points as if it were, because you're a retard

Unfortunately, I don't have a q'uran on hand, but I can tell you right off the bat that the whole notion of intelligent design is scientifically incorrect. I never said that only muslims say that their way is THE way, but in this thread, it happens to be Muslims who are saying it. If a Jew said it, I'd react in the exact same way, which I have in the past. From what you've shown hare so far, all you've done is been fed line upon line upon line of religious pseudo-interpretation, and you've taken it as truth without question. My study of religion (which, especially within the context of my own and christianity has been quite extensive) is infused with a healthy dosage of doubt so as to head off side effect of blind faith and being like you.

 :lol: @ your usage of 'undistorted.' I mean, if you meant to say 'distorted' then it would've sounded half-logical...I mean, if I were to study a text using contextually invalid and shoddy literary technique, I could conclude that each text shows that christ was a lecher, but theres no point in that, because anybody with half a brain and a knowledge of context and literary theory can see that such interpretation is groundless.

I never said that all Muslims are blind. I think YOU are blind. In fact, I lean towards the conclusion that all religious people are blind, although I've found a few exceptions...

I never said the q'uran was a copy of the bible, I said that it was influenced by the bible, which is only natural...look the figures of Abraham and Ishmael, look at the monotheistic similarities, look at the similarities in food laws...both are legitimate, and great, although flawed texts, written by some of the greatest minds oin human history, but they are both unworthy of human worship.

you still say it was written by Muhammad and his companions....  :booty:
and who the eff said we worship the book!???
 :cursing:
how am I blind?
read this again
"and many of them, when studied properly from the undistorted part of the religious texts (coz 95% of them were)"
can't you understand it?
many of the text were distorted, and the ones that weren't point out proofs of One true God and the coming of Prophet Muhammad and talks about the ten commandments etc
those weren't distorted and were original text sent down by God
Qur'an was the only one that wasn't changed at all, and it will stay as it is, as Allah promised

so many assumptions

does allah exist? And I'm saying the these texts were contextually misinterpreted...

also, all of these texts were written by people, so unless they logically prove something, they are essentially valueless to everyone except for people like you who feel the need to mold everything to their narrow worldview

I don't "assume" that Allah exists, or that the Qur'an is the Word of God
I know that they are true
that's what faith is all about
there is no room for doubt
and don't tell me this is blind following
there's a lot of proof in the Qur'an and Hadith of the Prophet to believe that what I'm following is true

It's not proof...I mean you need to have logically established the existence of a god for yourself in order not to be a blind believer...I mean I am very poetically inclined, so you might think that I'd believe in a god, and I've fluctuated in and out of belief for years. But the one thing I know for sure is the supremacy of words that create the conception of a god within the bible, within the q'uran, within our minds, within our poetry...we are the creators, god or no

[cigar omar]

If he knew anything about the Quran he wouldn't be saying the bible influenced the Quran. Because the Quran states that the Bible was also the word of God before parts of it had been modified.. So ofcourse there is going to be similarities.

Don't attack something you know nothing about.
 

[Royal Freakiness]

dude did you even read my post? Thats not at all what I said...but I'll address your points as if it were, because you're a retard

Unfortunately, I don't have a q'uran on hand, but I can tell you right off the bat that the whole notion of intelligent design is scientifically incorrect. I never said that only muslims say that their way is THE way, but in this thread, it happens to be Muslims who are saying it. If a Jew said it, I'd react in the exact same way, which I have in the past. From what you've shown hare so far, all you've done is been fed line upon line upon line of religious pseudo-interpretation, and you've taken it as truth without question. My study of religion (which, especially within the context of my own and christianity has been quite extensive) is infused with a healthy dosage of doubt so as to head off side effect of blind faith and being like you.

 :lol: @ your usage of 'undistorted.' I mean, if you meant to say 'distorted' then it would've sounded half-logical...I mean, if I were to study a text using contextually invalid and shoddy literary technique, I could conclude that each text shows that christ was a lecher, but theres no point in that, because anybody with half a brain and a knowledge of context and literary theory can see that such interpretation is groundless.

I never said that all Muslims are blind. I think YOU are blind. In fact, I lean towards the conclusion that all religious people are blind, although I've found a few exceptions...

I never said the q'uran was a copy of the bible, I said that it was influenced by the bible, which is only natural...look the figures of Abraham and Ishmael, look at the monotheistic similarities, look at the similarities in food laws...both are legitimate, and great, although flawed texts, written by some of the greatest minds oin human history, but they are both unworthy of human worship.

you still say it was written by Muhammad and his companions....  :booty:
and who the eff said we worship the book!???
 :cursing:
how am I blind?
read this again
"and many of them, when studied properly from the undistorted part of the religious texts (coz 95% of them were)"
can't you understand it?
many of the text were distorted, and the ones that weren't point out proofs of One true God and the coming of Prophet Muhammad and talks about the ten commandments etc
those weren't distorted and were original text sent down by God
Qur'an was the only one that wasn't changed at all, and it will stay as it is, as Allah promised

so many assumptions

does allah exist? And I'm saying the these texts were contextually misinterpreted...

also, all of these texts were written by people, so unless they logically prove something, they are essentially valueless to everyone except for people like you who feel the need to mold everything to their narrow worldview

I don't "assume" that Allah exists, or that the Qur'an is the Word of God
I know that they are true
that's what faith is all about
there is no room for doubt
and don't tell me this is blind following
there's a lot of proof in the Qur'an and Hadith of the Prophet to believe that what I'm following is true

It's not proof...I mean you need to have logically established the existence of a god for yourself in order not to be a blind believer...I mean I am very poetically inclined, so you might think that I'd believe in a god, and I've fluctuated in and out of belief for years. But the one thing I know for sure is the supremacy of words that create the conception of a god within the bible, within the q'uran, within our minds, within our poetry...we are the creators, god or no

you still believe that someone from this world created the Qur'an
I won't reply to any of your comments about the Qur'an....

[^_^]

alright break it up break it up...


tf10, you're a fool for insulting the quran. why? because with regard to thier belief, you probably couldn't show them a hole (and i'm assuming this because you still havn't done so). i also don't know why you've come here to attack them, or Jews, about thier beliefs..

now, granted, you're right to say that there is an imbalance in a biased and one sided view point. and you're also right to say that tito and royal are speaking rather narrow mindedly. that being said, the concept of faith (in a certain religion and god [islam, allah]) for the truely devoted means that they fully stand by what they believe in.

and with this being said, if thier religion teaches the understanding that allah created the quran, then why fight it? why fight the "holes" that you claim to be able to find? even if you could find them, are you out here to convert them into whatever it is you believe in?

fighting religion with science is one of the weirdest things to do; and of course the many concrete and some implied evidences of science are hard to be disproven, but the way i see it now, is to just let it go homie, because they are instilled to believe that there is no god but allah, and mohamed is his prophet.

oh and jono if you are in med school.....god damn....

[Jono]

oh and jono if you are in med school.....god damn....

Im startin my 1st year this year...what i know about evolution is what i know from high school. And why would i bother explaining evolution in this debate when i believe in God.

[^_^]

oh and jono if you are in med school.....god damn....

Im startin my 1st year this year...what i know about evolution is what i know from high school. And why would i bother explaining evolution in this debate when i believe in God.

i'm not familiar with how it works in (wherever you are from), but here you usually go to University first to get a degree in biological sciences, chemistry, etc. and you learn about a LOT of things (ecology and evolution included)

[L_I_S]

the q'uran has a whole fuckload of holes in it, just like the bible.

oh puh-lease. first thing, dont use the word fuck in the same sentence as any holy book. thats just rude.
i want 2 hear of these holes in the bible. i use 2 try 2 find holes in the bible too, but my teacher always had somthing.
so, go 4 it, unless ur willing 2 take back that remark.

and it doesnt matter who rote it physically, it matters that its still the word of God. yes, in the NKJ version of the bible, 7 chapters r excluded, but there r still recognised that they were taken out to all religious ppl.

[TheGodEmperor]

alright break it up break it up...


tf10, you're a fool for insulting the quran. why? because with regard to thier belief, you probably couldn't show them a hole (and i'm assuming this because you still havn't done so). i also don't know why you've come here to attack them, or Jews, about thier beliefs..

now, granted, you're right to say that there is an imbalance in a biased and one sided view point. and you're also right to say that tito and royal are speaking rather narrow mindedly. that being said, the concept of faith (in a certain religion and god [islam, allah]) for the truely devoted means that they fully stand by what they believe in.

and with this being said, if thier religion teaches the understanding that allah created the quran, then why fight it? why fight the "holes" that you claim to be able to find? even if you could find them, are you out here to convert them into whatever it is you believe in?

fighting religion with science is one of the weirdest things to do; and of course the many concrete and some implied evidences of science are hard to be disproven, but the way i see it now, is to just let it go homie, because they are instilled to believe that there is no god but allah, and mohamed is his prophet.

oh and jono if you are in med school.....god damn....

I'm not fighting religion with science, I'm fighting religious books with ideology...and I'm not attacking the q'uran, I'm treating it as a text like any other, and drawing its influences, etc...I do the same thing with the bible

I attack faith because it scares the hell out of me....many things that have been done as a result of faith are horrendous, and faith isolates man from man and creates inequality of perception. This occurs only when it is a large scale organized religion, and a symbol is required to keep such a group even a little cohesive -- some use idols, some use books. Both can be analyzed as works of art, which they are. Burt remember, all works of art are the result of a DEVIATION from blind faith into an entirely intellectual faith of their own, an individual faith

[^_^]

alright break it up break it up...


tf10, you're a fool for insulting the quran. why? because with regard to thier belief, you probably couldn't show them a hole (and i'm assuming this because you still havn't done so). i also don't know why you've come here to attack them, or Jews, about thier beliefs..

now, granted, you're right to say that there is an imbalance in a biased and one sided view point. and you're also right to say that tito and royal are speaking rather narrow mindedly. that being said, the concept of faith (in a certain religion and god [islam, allah]) for the truely devoted means that they fully stand by what they believe in.

and with this being said, if thier religion teaches the understanding that allah created the quran, then why fight it? why fight the "holes" that you claim to be able to find? even if you could find them, are you out here to convert them into whatever it is you believe in?

fighting religion with science is one of the weirdest things to do; and of course the many concrete and some implied evidences of science are hard to be disproven, but the way i see it now, is to just let it go homie, because they are instilled to believe that there is no god but allah, and mohamed is his prophet.

oh and jono if you are in med school.....god damn....

I'm not fighting religion with science, I'm fighting religious books with ideology...and I'm not attacking the q'uran, I'm treating it as a text like any other, and drawing its influences, etc...I do the same thing with the bible

I attack faith because it scares the hell out of me....many things that have been done as a result of faith are horrendous, and faith isolates man from man and creates inequality of perception. This occurs only when it is a large scale organized religion, and a symbol is required to keep such a group even a little cohesive -- some use idols, some use books. Both can be analyzed as works of art, which they are. Burt remember, all works of art are the result of a DEVIATION from blind faith into an entirely intellectual faith of their own, an individual faith

you cannot treat a holy book the same because it is implied that everything in the book is right. the book is designed for the reader as a follower, not as a spectator or one trying to draw conclusions. if the reader is a follower, then the reader is in 100% concurrence with the book. that is what it is designed for. don't read it and draw conclusions from it if you don't follow the religion for obvious reasons.

[TheGodEmperor]

alright break it up break it up...


tf10, you're a fool for insulting the quran. why? because with regard to thier belief, you probably couldn't show them a hole (and i'm assuming this because you still havn't done so). i also don't know why you've come here to attack them, or Jews, about thier beliefs..

now, granted, you're right to say that there is an imbalance in a biased and one sided view point. and you're also right to say that tito and royal are speaking rather narrow mindedly. that being said, the concept of faith (in a certain religion and god [islam, allah]) for the truely devoted means that they fully stand by what they believe in.

and with this being said, if thier religion teaches the understanding that allah created the quran, then why fight it? why fight the "holes" that you claim to be able to find? even if you could find them, are you out here to convert them into whatever it is you believe in?

fighting religion with science is one of the weirdest things to do; and of course the many concrete and some implied evidences of science are hard to be disproven, but the way i see it now, is to just let it go homie, because they are instilled to believe that there is no god but allah, and mohamed is his prophet.

oh and jono if you are in med school.....god damn....

I'm not fighting religion with science, I'm fighting religious books with ideology...and I'm not attacking the q'uran, I'm treating it as a text like any other, and drawing its influences, etc...I do the same thing with the bible

I attack faith because it scares the hell out of me....many things that have been done as a result of faith are horrendous, and faith isolates man from man and creates inequality of perception. This occurs only when it is a large scale organized religion, and a symbol is required to keep such a group even a little cohesive -- some use idols, some use books. Both can be analyzed as works of art, which they are. Burt remember, all works of art are the result of a DEVIATION from blind faith into an entirely intellectual faith of their own, an individual faith

you cannot treat a holy book the same because it is implied that everything in the book is right. the book is designed for the reader as a follower, not as a spectator or one trying to draw conclusions. if the reader is a follower, then the reader is in 100% concurrence with the book. that is what it is designed for. don't read it and draw conclusions from it if you don't follow the religion for obvious reasons.

Do you realize how many critical interpretations of the bible and quran there have been? Because the answer is a hell of a lot. And that added implications makes analysis all the more interesting.

[AznMagic]

alright break it up break it up...


tf10, you're a fool for insulting the quran. why? because with regard to thier belief, you probably couldn't show them a hole (and i'm assuming this because you still havn't done so). i also don't know why you've come here to attack them, or Jews, about thier beliefs..

now, granted, you're right to say that there is an imbalance in a biased and one sided view point. and you're also right to say that tito and royal are speaking rather narrow mindedly. that being said, the concept of faith (in a certain religion and god [islam, allah]) for the truely devoted means that they fully stand by what they believe in.

and with this being said, if thier religion teaches the understanding that allah created the quran, then why fight it? why fight the "holes" that you claim to be able to find? even if you could find them, are you out here to convert them into whatever it is you believe in?

fighting religion with science is one of the weirdest things to do; and of course the many concrete and some implied evidences of science are hard to be disproven, but the way i see it now, is to just let it go homie, because they are instilled to believe that there is no god but allah, and mohamed is his prophet.

oh and jono if you are in med school.....god damn....

I'm not fighting religion with science, I'm fighting religious books with ideology...and I'm not attacking the q'uran, I'm treating it as a text like any other, and drawing its influences, etc...I do the same thing with the bible

I attack faith because it scares the hell out of me....many things that have been done as a result of faith are horrendous, and faith isolates man from man and creates inequality of perception. This occurs only when it is a large scale organized religion, and a symbol is required to keep such a group even a little cohesive -- some use idols, some use books. Both can be analyzed as works of art, which they are. Burt remember, all works of art are the result of a DEVIATION from blind faith into an entirely intellectual faith of their own, an individual faith

you cannot treat a holy book the same because it is implied that everything in the book is right. the book is designed for the reader as a follower, not as a spectator or one trying to draw conclusions. if the reader is a follower, then the reader is in 100% concurrence with the book. that is what it is designed for. don't read it and draw conclusions from it if you don't follow the religion for obvious reasons.

Do you realize how many critical interpretations of the bible and quran there have been? Because the answer is a hell of a lot. And that added implications makes analysis all the more interesting.

dude just stop.  arguing with them is pointless, they've been indoctrinated for a long time probably.  it's like trying to convince cavemen that the earth is round.