Author Topic: Usama Bin Laden  (Read 8385 times)

a;sdlfkjas;df

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #48 on: Nov 17, 2008, 02:08: AM »
the taliban wasn't active until the mid-90s.  it was a blanket program to supply afghan mujahideen

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Al Qeada used to be backed by the US government when the soviet union attacked afganistan.

this was par for the course during the cold war

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when their job was done the US named them terrorist.

no they didn't.  al qaeda didn't exist until the late, late 80s or the early 90s, but regardless, we're the bully, right?

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if it wasn't for Al Qeada the Soviet Union would have taken over the stratigical point of afganistan, then war with America would be almost unperventable.

edit:  misinterpretation
« Last Edit: Nov 17, 2008, 03:48: AM by a;sdlfkjas;df »

Offline TheGodEmperor

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #49 on: Nov 17, 2008, 02:22: AM »
the taliban wasn't active until the mid-90s.  it was a blanket program to supply afghan mujahideen

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Al Qeada used to be backed by the US government when the soviet union attacked afganistan.

learn a little bit about world politics and soviet-us interaction.  this was par for the course during the cold war

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when their job was done the US named them terrorist.

no they didn't.  al qaeda didn't exist until the late, late 80s or the early 90s, but regardless, we're the bully, right?

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if it wasn't for Al Qeada the Soviet Union would have taken over the stratigical point of afganistan, then war with America would be almost unperventable.

if, if, if...

plus, that's highly debatable.  afghanistan is a very, very rough country.  the soviets had been having a difficult time everywhere but the cities
the US supported Mujahideen not because it gave the US power, but because it prevented the USSR from gaining power. In the Cold War era, everything was an issue of containment, anf Afghanistan is definitely an example of US containment policy. The Taliban arose from the original Mujahideen movement to seal off Afghanistan from Soviet control, and the US withdrew their support once
i.  the USSR crumbled
ii.  the Taliban began to commit atrocities

the US never supported Al Qaeda, because Al Qaeda was post-USSR, and was always fundamentally anti-western
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a;sdlfkjas;df

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #50 on: Nov 17, 2008, 03:46: AM »
did you even read my post?

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learn a little bit about world politics and soviet-us interaction.  this was par for the course during the cold war

people always act like it's something fucking sensational rather than the natural progression of things

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The Taliban arose from the original Mujahideen movement to seal off Afghanistan from Soviet control

one of many factions
« Last Edit: Nov 17, 2008, 04:01: AM by a;sdlfkjas;df »

Offline TheGodEmperor

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #51 on: Nov 17, 2008, 04:44: AM »
did you even read my post?

Quote
learn a little bit about world politics and soviet-us interaction.  this was par for the course during the cold war

people always act like it's something fucking sensational rather than the natural progression of things

Quote
The Taliban arose from the original Mujahideen movement to seal off Afghanistan from Soviet control

one of many factions
for the most part, I was agreeing with you...I was supporting your point lol

I was just clarifying a few things for those who are not versed in the policy of containment  :thumbsup:
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a;sdlfkjas;df

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #52 on: Nov 17, 2008, 06:01: AM »
it was early for me  :thumbsup:

sorry

Offline moby

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #53 on: Nov 17, 2008, 07:54: PM »
what with that? were just having a discussion.

it seems like connor and TF vs me and melbourne or something


i'm just giving my point and what i think


TF your just stating almost the exact thing i said just slightly different.



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a;sdlfkjas;df

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #54 on: Nov 18, 2008, 04:09: AM »
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TF your just stating almost the exact thing i said just slightly different.

there's a lot in this slightly different

this is not correct: 
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when their job was done the US named them terrorist

it wasn't necessarily because the "job (it was a mutually beneficial relationship)" had been done.  UBL essentially went after the US in the middle east.  now, whether or not you agree with the us from there (or with the US being in the middle east), is your prerogative
« Last Edit: Nov 18, 2008, 04:21: AM by a;sdlfkjas;df »

Offline cigar omar

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #55 on: Nov 18, 2008, 08:32: AM »
lol this is getting fun

Al Qeada used to be backed by the US government when the soviet union attacked afganistan. when their job was done the US named them terrorist.

if it wasn't for Al Qeada the Soviet Union would have taken over the stratigical point of afganistan, then war with America would be almost unperventable.

Al Qaeda was never backed by the U.S...the Taliban was at one point before they got all radical, because they wanted to counteract soviet control of Afghanistan

However, the US soon withdrew that support once they heard about the atrocities that the Taliban were comitting (mass executions at half time during soccer games, etc)

I'm not a supporter of the Taliban nor do I give a fuck. But tell me what about the Atrocities Israel has been committing over the past 6-7 decades? I never see you mention this, in fact you support it. Get the fuck out of here, I hate hypocrites.

Yeah you can execute people in mass numbers at half time, the grounds keeps will drain the field of blood before the teams come back on to resume the second half. Get your shit together, don't yell out shit you hear from people..  :rolleyes:

Offline TW89

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #56 on: Nov 18, 2008, 08:42: AM »
Al Qaeda was never backed by the U.S...the Taliban was at one point before they got all radical, because they wanted to counteract soviet control of Afghanistan

However, the US soon withdrew that support once they heard about the atrocities that the Taliban were comitting (mass executions at half time during soccer games, etc)

I'm not a supporter of the Taliban nor do I give a fuck. But tell me what about the Atrocities Israel has been committing over the past 6-7 decades? I never see you mention this, in fact you support it. Get the fuck out of here, I hate hypocrites.

Yeah you can execute people in mass numbers at half time, the grounds keeps will drain the field of blood before the teams come back on to resume the second half. Get your shit together, don't yell out shit you hear from people..  :rolleyes:

How dare you speak like that to tf10! They way your going he'll tell you to go back to school and get an education! And also to read a book. Because you know, he is the emperor of all knowledge...




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Offline TheGodEmperor

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #57 on: Nov 18, 2008, 08:56: AM »
lol this is getting fun

Al Qeada used to be backed by the US government when the soviet union attacked afganistan. when their job was done the US named them terrorist.

if it wasn't for Al Qeada the Soviet Union would have taken over the stratigical point of afganistan, then war with America would be almost unperventable.


Al Qaeda was never backed by the U.S...the Taliban was at one point before they got all radical, because they wanted to counteract soviet control of Afghanistan

However, the US soon withdrew that support once they heard about the atrocities that the Taliban were comitting (mass executions at half time during soccer games, etc)

I'm not a supporter of the Taliban nor do I give a fuck. But tell me what about the Atrocities Israel has been committing over the past 6-7 decades? I never see you mention this, in fact you support it. Get the fuck out of here, I hate hypocrites.

Yeah you can execute people in mass numbers at half time, the grounds keeps will drain the field of blood before the teams come back on to resume the second half. Get your shit together, don't yell out shit you hear from people..  :rolleyes:
as opposed to not reading, not thinking, NOT EVEN WATCHING THE FUCKING NEWS (which you said earlier but then apparently removed it), and then expecting others to take you seriously? Also, Israel has barely been around for 6 decades.

A) Who says that I can't denounce that Taliban and not be called a hypocrite? Am I Israeli? Do I live in Israel?

B) Israel has never initiated violence. It always responds to an attack from neighboring countries (recently, Hamas and Hezbollah).  In addition, Israel tries to root out terrorists and tries to limit their bombing so that it will create minimum damage with maximum efficiency. They are not indiscriminate. They search for terrorist groups, and try to pin down their location before bombing. Unfortunately, these terrorists groups send missiles into Israel while hiding amongst the civilians, so that if Israel bombs them, they are also killing innocent people. This benefits the terrorists in two ways: one, they are harder to find because they blend in with the common people, and two, they know that Israel will be more reluctant to bomb them if they use innocent people as shields. Now I'm not saying Israel hasn't made some big mistakes, because they have. Putting up that wall/fence around their border with Palestine was fucking dumb and worsened relations. But comparing Israel with the Taliban is fairly ridiculous.

now lets go through a bit of history: in the '90s, Yitzchak Rabin made peace with Yaser Arafat. Rabin was assassinated by a madman, and Arafat suddenly turned down the exact same offer for peace that the new president/prime minister made. Then, a couple years later, Ehud Barak offered Palestine all of the Gaza Strip, and most of the West bank. That is a huge portion of Israel. Arafat turned it down, and allowed Hamas to continue suicide bombing Israeli cities. So, uuhhhh...I can't say that Israel is blame free, because it's not, but you can't place the blame squarely on Israeli soldiers because that is preposterous. 


oh and also, tw89, if you don't give me proof otherwise, I still assume that you haven't read a book and that you're spewin garbage. Nobody is backing their arguments here. Melbourne (or cigar omar, whatever) has given me no specific events, no names, no dates, no policies, nothing. This leads me to believe that he knows none of these things and is also spewing re-processed garbage. Prove me wrong, people, prove me wrong....
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Offline moby

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #58 on: Nov 18, 2008, 05:18: PM »
lol this is getting fun

Al Qeada used to be backed by the US government when the soviet union attacked afganistan. when their job was done the US named them terrorist.

if it wasn't for Al Qeada the Soviet Union would have taken over the stratigical point of afganistan, then war with America would be almost unperventable.


Al Qaeda was never backed by the U.S...the Taliban was at one point before they got all radical, because they wanted to counteract soviet control of Afghanistan

However, the US soon withdrew that support once they heard about the atrocities that the Taliban were comitting (mass executions at half time during soccer games, etc)

I'm not a supporter of the Taliban nor do I give a fuck. But tell me what about the Atrocities Israel has been committing over the past 6-7 decades? I never see you mention this, in fact you support it. Get the fuck out of here, I hate hypocrites.

Yeah you can execute people in mass numbers at half time, the grounds keeps will drain the field of blood before the teams come back on to resume the second half. Get your shit together, don't yell out shit you hear from people..  :rolleyes:


oh and also, tw89, if you don't give me proof otherwise, I still assume that you haven't read a book and that you're spewin garbage. Nobody is backing their arguments here. Melbourne (or cigar omar, whatever) has given me no specific events, no names, no dates, no policies, nothing. This leads me to believe that he knows none of these things and is also spewing re-processed garbage. Prove me wrong, people, prove me wrong....


and thats wat you get for sticking up for this motherfucker


i get it now conor but the rest i strongly believe in.

maybe Al-Qeada turned on america after the gulf war?  :dontknow:

either way i think something ticked of them and thats when they began fighting with America. am i right?


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a;sdlfkjas;df

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Re: Usama Bin Laden
« Reply #59 on: Nov 18, 2008, 05:20: PM »
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either way i think something ticked of them and thats when they began fighting with America. am i right?

it wasn't any one thing.  a lot of it has to do with the american presence in the middle east

although:

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Quote
when their job was done the US named them terrorist

it wasn't necessarily because the "job (it was a mutually beneficial relationship)" had been done.  UBL essentially went after the US in the middle east.  now, whether or not you agree with the us from there (or with the US being in the middle east), is your prerogative

there is more to this.  the mujahideen felt as if they had been cast off (what you had hinted at).  which was partially true, but it wasn't an immediate 180 (the us never went "thanks.  now fuck off, it's your turn").  it was more of an "indifference"

it's a weird conflict.  it's very different than the traditional national struggles, but the middle east is different in and of itself (in organization e.g. the mujahideen were fighting for islam rather than afghanistan)
« Last Edit: Nov 18, 2008, 06:35: PM by a;sdlfkjas;df »