English Clubs are the Best

[^_^]

The last English team to win the Champions League was Liverpool in 2005. Before that, United in 1999. And United hasn't made the semi finals in a while. AC Milan demolished them. I actually remember when Manchester United couldn't make it out of the group stages, the same group with Villareal and Lille :lol:

But right, so we have 3 English teams in the semi finals. This is obviously good for England. But think about it; Chelsea played a Turkish team and a Greek team. No offense to you Turkey and Greece, but come on.

United played Lyon, and in my eyes were lucky when Tevez scored that tying goal away. Sure Lyon is France's best team by far, but we look at the fact that United relied on having a lot of luck and the best player in the world to get them through. Then United played Roma, who they are obviously familiar with playing. 7-1? And this isn't an easy draw for United? Especially when they have the best player in the world. Even then, Roma had to play without Totti, who definitely could have had an impact on the legs.

Liverpool had Inter Milan. This again shows the love refs have for Liverpool. I believe it was an extremely questionable red card recieved by Materazzi. And let's say it wasn't questionable. Then Liverpool had to wait for Gerrard to just rip a shot. Ohh, Benetiz must have used some ACE tactics to get Gerrard to rip a shot in. Torres, however, scored an excellent goal in the away match. So Liverpool does get good credit for this. Liverpool then proceeded to play Arsenal.

Arsenal had to play AC Milan. This, by far, was the only display that an English team put out that was eye opening and you all know it. This was the tie of the season, and Arsenal played the best football of the year at the San Siro. Anyone who watches the game here knows this. Arsenal then proceeded to play Liverpool.

So as for English teams, from what I see, Liverpool and Arsenal are the only one's who really proved something for England. The other two got easy draws; this is very true. So this season England happened to get the best out of the rest of world by luck. Yes, I belive luck played a big factor in a lot of the English victories. Even Drogba's lucky cross that got Chelsea an away goal.

So England has one all star year and the crowd goes wild, but again wait, English teams don't win the Champions League too often now do they? It's like saying Drogba is the best striker in the world because he scored 32 goals last season. It's consistency that makes a player the best. It's consistency that makes a league the best.  :hello: So it may look like England has the better teams, but in the long run, they do not.

[cigar omar]

The last English team to win the Champions League was Liverpool in 2005. Before that, United in 1999. And United hasn't made the semi finals in a while. AC Milan demolished them. I actually remember when Manchester United couldn't make it out of the group stages, the same group with Villareal and Lille :lol:

I'll never forget that.
2005/06: UEFA Champions League - group stage
2004/05: UEFA Champions League - first knockout round
2003/04: UEFA Champions League - first knockout round

Acting like Manchester United is the best club in the world when they haven't been able to even reach the quarter finals 3 years in a row getting knocked out by Benfica and what not. Its not about how many English clubs can make the Semi finals its about how many of them can win? Remember last year with Milan-Liverpool-Chelsea-United and Milan rained supreme?  Don't even bother people.

Remember 99/00? Three Spanish teams 2 of them face off in the final

Valencia   5-3   Barcelona   4-1   1-2

Real Madrid   3-2   Bayern   2-0   1-2

02/03 Three Italian teams 2 of them face off in the final.

Real Madrid   3-4   Juventus   

Milan (ag)    1-1   Internazionale

The only time I can remember 3 English teams being in the semi final none of them won.    :lol:

[Adi]

I am talking about right now, not the past 10 years. I would never make this thread if I were talking about the past.

This year, and maybe even the last year, England has had the best top teams. I don't think there's any reason for this to change over the next five years. England will continue to have the best top teams because of their attraction of rich owners and quality foreign players.

ELITE, you are talking about the match-ups like it was the first time its ever happened. In the past, teams have had easier draws than others. It happens every year, and it's not a good enough reason to take credit away from the English teams. To be honest, their road was not even easy. Roma beat Madrid, and then Roma got beat by Man U. Last year, they got raped even worse and they had Totti. Liverpool had Inter Milan, which was a very touch draw. Arsenal had Milan. That's all I have to say. And United played Lyon. Oh my God, what a easy draw?!

How about Barcelona managing it through against Schalke? Very tough... there probably wouldn't even be a Spanish or Italian team left in the semis had Barca not had that easy draw.

I don't know about you all but there should be no reason to take anything away from what the English teams have been able to do.

I used to hate English football and everything that had to do with England, but I've learned to appreciate what they have done with their league. If I can say that they have the top clubs, I think some of you can as well. I see lots of members who are being stubborn and ignorant regarding English football. Give their league some credit... and by doing so, you are just giving their teams credit, not that shit national team that continues to under-perform.

[moby]

what ELITE is saying is right. and Adi i am sure that this year will be a one off english year. you have to look at the quality of the football. yes english teams may be winning right now but look do you really think they deserve it. Adi yeah english teams are not really the english national team but the way they play is exactly the same. right now the only time i think that plays real football is arsenal maybe because they dont have one english player on the field. :nopity:

[Adi]

They don't play like England though... look at all the foreign talent on all the top English teams! That makes them play different. Hell, even the English top players are starting to play a better style of football.

To me it seems you are referring to English football from 10 years ago when Shearer used to bang in 30 goals a season. That's not how the game is played anymore in England. Whatever style English teams play is even better than what they play in Spain and Italy. It's 10 times more interesting.

And I think English teams are going to continue being the best in Europe over the next 5 years. Just look how the league has grown and how much money is in it. I hope you realize that money tends to run things nowadays. I don't agree with it but it's just the way it is. English teams are going to continue getting richer due to their owners and are therefore going to sign higher profile players. The English league is only getting better... sorry to break the news to you buddy.

[moby]

more intersting? you tell me what would you rather watch a match between Madird vs Barca or chelsea vs Man utd. i dont even have to think of the answer

[Tito]

the only reason that Engish football looks better is because the money the teams have and all the foreign talent if they had the rules that other leagues have of limited foreign players they would be the shittest league  not that they are far of at the moment

[^_^]

If England had the best clubs last year and the year before, then the champions of England wouldn't have been trounced by AC Milan, who I think were in 3rd place or something. To be honest, the only reason that an English team has won the champions league recently was just a bizzare game when Liverpool came back.

The probability that an English team wins the Champions League is high this year. But just ask yourself how exciting the semi-final between Liverpool and Chelsea will be; neither of them play football :booty:

[a;sdlfkjas;df]

If England had the best clubs last year and the year before

I'm pretty sure this thread is about this year and "maybe" last year.

then the champions of England wouldn't have been trounced by AC Milan, who I think were in 3rd place or something.

Who was second?  Where was first?  Good point.  No really.  I like how you don't let reality get in the way of a good argument.  ;)

To be honest, the only reason that an English team has won the champions league recently was just a bizzare game when Liverpool came back.

Right now.  Not 2 and 2/3 years ago.  Not 3 3/8 years ago.  This year.  This season.

Liverpool and Chelsea will be; neither of them play football

Yeah.  Those are two great basketball teams.

I would respond to the other posts, but I'm pretty sure you've all said similar things...over and over again.

Now, can you all get a decent discussion going? or are you all going to continue to suck each others cocks?

[^_^]

Oh, well AC Milan was in second place i'm sorry.

You know, I can't sit here and say which league has the best teams based on one year. I don't see how all of you can either. It's one tournament, a knockout tournament at that. Imagine if there was a 38 game league compiled of different teams from the various leagues; this would be a way to see which country really does have the best teams.

The Champions League isn't the most accurate representation of which country has the better teams; it just shows who came to play in the knockout competition. Just like the World Cup or any other tournament; it gives a somewhat decent representation of who is better. Everything factors in to these sorts of things; perhaps if Chelsea had to play Roma they would have lost. It all depends on the two teams playing and how they match up against each other. It's more than being a good team, it's about being damn lucky.

A team like Manchester United can't be lucky and be in first place in England right now; they are outright better than the other teams because they've had the same matchups as every other teams. Inter Milan isn't lucky to be in first in Italy for the same reason. This is why I think it's not accurate to say that English teams are the best teams in the world because of thier performances in the Champions League for one season. If there was a growth of English teams winning the Champions League year after year, or more consitently, then it would be far easier to say that they are the better teams. I just don't see how you all can gather English teams being the best because they are 3 of them in the semi finals of the Champions League this year.

Really though, what if Barcelona wins the competition? I do not think this will happen, but what will you all say then? This season English teams are the best in the world, but Barcelona won the Champions League.


Another thing I'd like to point out; this is titled English Clubs are the best. What about the other teams? I know Adi began talking about the top teams, but the lower half and middle of the tables? I guess we'll look at the UEFA Cup? England hasn't been so hot in the UEFA Cup, what does this tell you about the rest of the league compared to the rest of the other leagues? So England has the best league in the world, but only 4 teams can play? Yes the Big 4 are always strong but they have no competition in the domestic league.

[a;sdlfkjas;df]

Oh, well AC Milan was in second place i'm sorry.

They finished fourth.  AS Roma finished second.  That's what I was alluding to.

That's a reasonable post, but I don't think you can utilize a series of successes over years to determine who is the best team right at this moment of time.  Teams change from year to year.

I think what Adi was trying to get at was that these English teams, right now, are better than all similar collections of teams all over the world.  Whatever any other teams have acheived in these competitions in the past at these clubs is completely unrelated.

I'd agree with you that it's difficult to determine which collection of teams is better than the others through Champions League results.  However, I also think that the burden of proof rests with those who disagree.  I would argue that this proof needs to go beyond "it looks bad," "I don't like it," "it's technically inferior," etc.

[^_^]

Well yes, teams change. And I understand what is being fed in front of me. But comparing the 1-4 of leagues by thier progress in a knockout tournament is rediculous. And this is why I said I can deal with Arsenal and Liverpool being better than two of Italy's top teams; they actually played and outplayed thier opponents. And even with them playing, it is still difficult to be able to outright say which teams are better. In single games, as I said, luck and a lot of things factor into games. Real Madrid hasn't played Chelsea, or United or so on and so forth. They havn't played the same teams in the same year, or gone through the same amount of games vs the same teams.

They aren't being put to the same tests is the main point i'm getting at. And I think this greatly factors into who is better.